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i too have problems with this proposal, as i hinted at the meeting. if the fee system is too complex, the nir system adds far more complexity to apnic process, as we can see by the process of this very proposal. if we are to abolish complexity, clearly the nir system is the first thing to go. :-)/2 but it is certainly amusing that a stepped fee with a minimum is too complex. shall we put in an hd ratio instead? :-) more appropriately, i suggest that, at the perth meeting, the lirs have a meeting where they can abolish fees for lirs. randy